Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors · HackerPapers discussions

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by shunza

Sun, 09 Jul 2023 19:08:31 GMT

A comment from "https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36208585" A Critical Examination of "The Art of the Fugue" Paper in Relation to OT The introductory paragraph of the paper's abstract states: "Existing algorithms for replicated lists, which are widely used in collaborative text editors, suffer from a problem: when two users concurrently insert text at the same position in the document, the merged outcome may interleave the inserted text passages, resulting in corrupted and potentially unreadable text. The problem has gone unnoticed for decades, and it affects both CRDTs and Operational…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by czsun

Tue, 06 Jun 2023 06:08:37 GMT

A Critical Examination of "The Art of the Fugue" Paper in Relation to OT The introductory paragraph of the paper's abstract states: "Existing algorithms for replicated lists, which are widely used in collaborative text editors, suffer from a problem: when two users concurrently insert text at the same position in the document, the merged outcome may interleave the inserted text passages, resulting in corrupted and potentially unreadable text. The problem has gone unnoticed for decades, and it affects both CRDTs and Operational Transformation." The issue of text interleaving in certain CRDT…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by teleforce

Thu, 09 Sep 2021 14:29:59 GMT

I have been using desktop applications for more than 30 years and web for more than 20 years now. I loathe web based applications as the next guy but can appreciate the convenient it provides. As anything in life, it comes like a cycle and and after web it will probably be desktop again with a twist. Most likely a desktop with local-first software paradigm [1]. That will not happen until the two important issues are solved, firstly seamless distributed data replication and security. The first issue can probably be solved by Commutative Replicated Data Type (CRDT) and/or Operational…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by teleforce

Sat, 31 Jul 2021 14:58:34 GMT

This previous HN discussions on OT vs CRDT paper is an excellent overview of the topics [1],[2]. From the paper conclusions "Our discoveries from this work revealed facts and evidences that refute CRDT superiority claims over OT on all accounts, which helps to explain the underlying reasons behind the choices between OT and CRDT in the real world." The fact that the paper provided the refutation to one of the HN discussion points being made in [1] (i.e. reference to itself), regarding the claimed of CRDT superiority in its footnotes is rather amusing and the first such attempt I have…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by AnthonBerg

Tue, 07 May 2019 08:54:52 GMT

I found this recent paper highly enlightening: “Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors”– Chengzheng Sun, David Sun, Agustina, Weiwei Cai, October 2018. Arxiv meta: https://arxiv.org/abs/1810.02137 PDF: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1810.02137.pdf It’s well written imo. The conclusions chapter is very good. “In this work, we have critically reviewed and evaluated representative OT and CRDT solutions, with respect to correctness, time and space complexity, simplicity, applicability in real world co- editors, and suitability in peer-to-peer co-editing. The evidences and evaluation results…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — mentioned by Reinmar

Tue, 16 Oct 2018 18:54:48 GMT

Oh, that's really tempting :) Believe us! There are people in our team who would love to dive deeper into CRDT. We confirm that OT definitely has its problems. It's elegant at first but gets really dirty the deeper you dive into this... hole. Especially the undo feature adds to it a tone of complexity. So, some of my colleagues see CRDT as a potential saviour. There was even a paper on CRDT for tree structures that we might use (can't find a link now). However, we'd rather go with a linear model for CRDT. That'd make it a bit easier on the CRDT level but it would require some really smart…

Paper and discussion history. A mention is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — HN submission

Thu, 11 Oct 2018 08:48:06 GMT

Real Differences Between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors

100 points; 62 discussion replies on HN. Paper and source history. A submission is not an endorsement.

Real Differences between OT and CRDT for Co-Editors — HN submission

Thu, 11 Oct 2018 03:59:59 GMT

Real differences between ot and crdt for co-editors

There is a hot topic on two consistency maintenance techniques for Co-editors, Operational Transformation (OT) and Commutative replicated data type(CRDT). Choosing between them for implementing a real-world co-editor is hard. Common evidence of OT-supporters is that OT has been widely adopted in industrial products, like Google Docs, Dropbox Paper, etc., and OT is a reliable technique. Common evidence of CRDT-supporters is that Google Wave OT requires a central server, but CRDT does not have this constraint and is especially suitable for P2P network environments. So, what is the truth?…

5 points; 2 discussion replies on HN. Paper and source history. A submission is not an endorsement.